I get your point, you're so sharp

There's nothing your Insufferable Music Snob (© Amanda) loves better than playing The Academy of the Overrated, so this Guardian piece is good fun. However, at the risk of turning this blog into Television Central, I can't resist quoting this bit:

Television, Marquee Moon Nominated by Alex Kapranos of Franz Ferdinand

People expect us to love Television the way they think we love Gang of Four and were influenced by them - but we don't and we weren't! Marquee Moon is one of those records that I thought I loved, but it was only after a few years I realised I didn't love the album, just the first 10 bars of the title track, which are pretty astonishing. Those guitars that play off each other and the way the instruments go into wonderful places and the guitars are totally insane and that big cascade of drums - it's incredible. Then your attention wanders. You know when a boring guy is explaining to you the technical spec of a car, the fuel injection system and the leather seats, and his voice becomes so much background noise? Once I took the needle off this record, I realised I hadn't heard it at all. But what annoys me is the way people pontificate over the album; it's one of those staples of student halls of residence. People wax lyrical about it, but the reason it's so popular is because it's a prog rock album its okay to like. Because the words "punk" and "New York" and "1977" are associated with it, it's deemed cool. Really, though, they're a band who give guys who like 20-minute guitar solos an excuse. They were the Grateful Dead of punk, and I always hated all that jam-band stuff. They have the ethos of a jam-band but the aesthetic of a New York outfit. If anything, the Strokes took the look of Television, the aesthetic - and the Converse sneakers - and ignored the jam-band aspect. They took those first 10 bars of Marquee Moon and did something great with it! Tom Verlaine's lyrics didn't have much impact on me. I'm always uneasy when singers in bands profess to be poets - they can veer into pomposity and pretentiousness. But I've got to be careful: I once said something about Jim Morrison and the Doors, about their pseudo-poetry, and immediately all these articles on the internet appeared saying, "Kapranos slams Morrison!" I'm not slamming Television - I respect them. But Marquee Moon is an album I admire more than enjoy.

The thing is, he's not wrong -- Television do have "the ethos of a jam-band but the aesthetic of a New York outfit." That is precisely what makes them interesting, as opposed to a drearily derivative and predictable band like... oh, I don't know, let's say Franz Ferdinand.

Comments

[mwanji]

1.

That Ian Williams's Krapanos's contributions follow each other is hilarious.

[Tim Rutherford-Johnson]

2.

Green Gartside is about the only one in that piece to even attempt a sensible argument based on, you know, the music...

[ec]

3.

Actually I think you're both wrong about Television having "the ethos of a jam-band" - either you guys don't understand the so-called ethos of a jam-band or you guys aren't that familiar with Television. Long solos do not equate the ethos of a jam-band!! Television has always based their playing, soloing and all, around well defined structures and riffs - with Richard Lloyd in particular putting lots of time into the structure of his parts. Tom Verlaine's soloing if often exploratory but always within a defined structure. There is very little that would constitute "jamming" as those in the jam-band world would see these things. The point you guys make has been made many times however (it seems that to most long solos do equate to the jam-band ethos), so much so that the point has been raised to Verlaine and Lloyd themselves in interviews over the years - always soundly trumped by the men themselves. Regardless, it's good to see some Television coverage out there.

[DJA]

4.

Television has always based their playing, soloing and all, around well defined structures and riffs - with Richard Lloyd in particular putting lots of time into the structure of his parts. Tom Verlaine's soloing if often exploratory but always within a defined structure. There is very little that would constitute "jamming" as those in the jam-band world would see these things.

EC, these are all excellent points and I don't disagree with any of them. But when Karpanos says "the ethos of a jam band," he's not speaking from any deep understanding of different ways of soloing. He's just observing that Television are not fundamentally averse to long virtuosic guitar solos, and in his view, that's an inherently bad thing, regardless of how structured or effective the solos are. I think we both agree that Karpanos's view is simplistic and lame.

So I was just turning his words around on him -- "yeah, okay, so what if Television are a New York punk band that (sometimes) includes long virtuosic guitar solos -- isn't that already a more interesting concept than your band?"

[Maggie Osterberg]

5.

"yeah, okay, so what if Television are a New York punk band that (sometimes) includes long virtuosic guitar solos -- isn't that already a more interesting concept than your band?"

Hells yeah, says I!

Also, I've always heard Television as being more spike-y and focused than the shambolic jam bands I've heard. Dare I say, "more Jazzy?"

[Reuben Radding]

6.

Enjoying the TV talk. My blog is secretly named after a Tom Verlaine album & song...

[Drew]

7.

Coming late to this party, with an even older link, in the unlikely event you missed Matthew Fluxblog's confab with Rob Sheffield earlier this year, re many things, among them the possibility of a mix tape made up entirely of versions of "MM." Ultimately not my idea of a good time, but the 1978 version included at the bottom of this post is worth the time-investment (unless you jam econo):
http://www.fluxblog.org/2007/03/fluxblog-interview-with-rob-sheffield_01.html